Greetings!
I am sure that many of our regular readers may be familiar with my friend Dan Harms. Dan is currently working on a few literary projects and the Necronomicon Info Page staff would like to wish him all the best.
Recently, Dan left a few comments in response to this article:
http://warlockasyluminternationalnews.com/2010/07/27/occultist-h-p-lovecrafts-initiation-into-the-black-brotherhood/
Below are the thoughts of the legendary writer and Lovecraftian expert Dan Harms:
“Warlock,
I’d still maintain that Lovecraft was not an initiate. I think the following questions remain to be answered:
1) Why is it important that a Turkic language convention exists, when Sumerian is unrelated to that tongue?
2) Is there any connection between Manichean doctrines and the theology outlined in The Call of Cthulhu itself?
I should also note that your Lovecraft quote is incorrect. The original, in “The Whisperer in Darkness,” has only half the text, not including some parts from which you are drawing your conclusions.”
Let us look a little more closely into Dan’s questions:
Dan: asked: “Why is it important that a Turkic language convention exists, when Sumerian is unrelated to that tongue?”
Warlock answers: It is true Dan that Sumerian is unrelated to the Turkic language. However, one must understand that we are NOT talking about the Simon Necronomicon, but reviewing some of what Lovecraft implied in reference to the Cult of Cthulhu. Lovecraft mentioned that the Cult of Cthulhu was centered in Arabia with several members who were immortal living in the mountains of China (paraphrase). Historically, this would refer to Uighur Empire, which stretched from the Caspian Sea to Manchuria. This seems to fit perfectly into what Lovecraft implied, as far as, the dominions of the Cult of Cthulhu.
Dan asked: Is there any connection between Manichean doctrines and the theology outlined in The Call of Cthulhu itself?
Warlock answered: That’s an interesting question Dan. Included in the Manichean canon is the Book of Giants. Fragements of this text were among the infamous Dead Sea scrolls and in part, relate heavily to Lovecraft’s Old Ones. The Book of Giants describe “Watchers” who descended from the sky and taught man technology, as well as, “new ways of killing himself.” The book also elaborates on the acts of the giants with a focus on the dreams of Ohya and Hahya, the children of Shemihaza. Uhmm, I don’t know what to tell you Dan. Here you have an empire that stretched from the Caspian Sea to what is now called China, which included a ruler who the Chinese historically called Ku-tu-lu, and they had a doctrine of Manichean, which focused on the descent of primordial beings, and their violent interactions with man, and it is also mentioned how these “Old Ones” received messages in dreams, specifically those who were half-nephilim and half-human, and your under the impression that 1,000 years later, Lovecraft just makes all of these things up and puts it in his fiction without questioning how someone who claims that they weren’t an occultist has some much material that relates to ancient history. Don’t worry Dan, I live in New York too, and the heat wave is pretty strong drink plenty of water.
Stay Blessed
I am sure that many of our regular readers may be familiar with my friend Dan Harms. Dan is currently working on a few literary projects and the Necronomicon Info Page staff would like to wish him all the best.
Recently, Dan left a few comments in response to this article:
http://warlockasyluminternationalnews.com/2010/07/27/occultist-h-p-lovecrafts-initiation-into-the-black-brotherhood/
Below are the thoughts of the legendary writer and Lovecraftian expert Dan Harms:
“Warlock,
I’d still maintain that Lovecraft was not an initiate. I think the following questions remain to be answered:
1) Why is it important that a Turkic language convention exists, when Sumerian is unrelated to that tongue?
2) Is there any connection between Manichean doctrines and the theology outlined in The Call of Cthulhu itself?
I should also note that your Lovecraft quote is incorrect. The original, in “The Whisperer in Darkness,” has only half the text, not including some parts from which you are drawing your conclusions.”
Let us look a little more closely into Dan’s questions:
Dan: asked: “Why is it important that a Turkic language convention exists, when Sumerian is unrelated to that tongue?”
Warlock answers: It is true Dan that Sumerian is unrelated to the Turkic language. However, one must understand that we are NOT talking about the Simon Necronomicon, but reviewing some of what Lovecraft implied in reference to the Cult of Cthulhu. Lovecraft mentioned that the Cult of Cthulhu was centered in Arabia with several members who were immortal living in the mountains of China (paraphrase). Historically, this would refer to Uighur Empire, which stretched from the Caspian Sea to Manchuria. This seems to fit perfectly into what Lovecraft implied, as far as, the dominions of the Cult of Cthulhu.
Dan asked: Is there any connection between Manichean doctrines and the theology outlined in The Call of Cthulhu itself?
Warlock answered: That’s an interesting question Dan. Included in the Manichean canon is the Book of Giants. Fragements of this text were among the infamous Dead Sea scrolls and in part, relate heavily to Lovecraft’s Old Ones. The Book of Giants describe “Watchers” who descended from the sky and taught man technology, as well as, “new ways of killing himself.” The book also elaborates on the acts of the giants with a focus on the dreams of Ohya and Hahya, the children of Shemihaza. Uhmm, I don’t know what to tell you Dan. Here you have an empire that stretched from the Caspian Sea to what is now called China, which included a ruler who the Chinese historically called Ku-tu-lu, and they had a doctrine of Manichean, which focused on the descent of primordial beings, and their violent interactions with man, and it is also mentioned how these “Old Ones” received messages in dreams, specifically those who were half-nephilim and half-human, and your under the impression that 1,000 years later, Lovecraft just makes all of these things up and puts it in his fiction without questioning how someone who claims that they weren’t an occultist has some much material that relates to ancient history. Don’t worry Dan, I live in New York too, and the heat wave is pretty strong drink plenty of water.
Stay Blessed
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Yet, isn’t it possible that Lovecraft could have learned this same material through reading? Just before writing “The Call of Cthulhu,” he was reading extensively at the New York Public Library’s Main Reading Room. Could that not have been sufficient to reveal many of his facts to him, without requiring an initiation?
I’ve made similar speculations on the Cult of Cthulhu forum in a similar discussion, Dan. I am a local of Lovecraft, a Rhode Island native all of my life, & I am aware of many of the resources he might of had exposure to here. Those include the Masons as one of, if not the first Masonic lodge in the United States was founded here as well as the first synagogue in the U.S. Lovecraft also lived right down the block from Brown University which has an excellent Egyptology department. & there also exists a Hindu society that I can’t remember the name of off hand, but it was also around in Lovecraft’s day, not to mention the resources he would have had access to in New York; so yes, I can fully appreciate the validity of your argument.
Now, taking things a step further, & I’m sure I will be crucified for this, let’s examine the effect of this one story, “The Call of Cthulhu” has had on a select minority in our society over the years.
In his story, Lovecraft states that Dead Cthulhu spoke to artists, occultists, & those “sensitive” to the messages from the “other side” so to speak. Over the last 90 years give or take, that one story has influenced generations of artists, occultists, & “sensitives”. From one story of one pulp author out of Providence, RI, an entire genre has risen that spans all forms of artistic & metaphysical expression. I’m not sure of many personalities who could have that kind of phenomena attached to their name; especially one who lived such an obscure life.
Take this as pure speculation & conjecture as you will, but to me, there seems to be something to this & this evidence added to the many parallels with Aleister Crowley’s work, as well as even more ancient sources to me, makes an extremely plausible argument for Lovecraft’s initiatory experience. Whether he was a member of an actual order or was initiated by the forces themselves can & most likely will be debated for years to come, but to me, the evidence of his influence on such a grand scale speaks for itself.
Blessings.